We've done a lot of studies to see when they do happen, why, and I mean there's a variety of reasons. But one, it starts with a commitment where they decide this is going to be who we are. Maybe it's out of their faith, a new way of looking at their faith, that we must be integrated across race.

So you find a lot of these sixth Americans congregate in these interracial congregations. They hang out together at work, at school, wherever.

What sort of difficulties would happen when people of different cultures try to come together to worship? Tiny little things such as let's tell jokes with each other.

I think of myself as a problem-solver. I want to go in and help the director and the writer to get the best they can out of the text they're working with.

So different groups have different definitions, and then they clash on those. So it takes adept leadership to say we're going to work through these.

I meet almost no one that goes to an African-American church or thinks, "I'm going to do that." Now there are whites in African-American churches. They're interracially married. They're highly committed. Maybe there's a professor or two, or a student.

I ask the clergy why don't I see myself represented in leadership? And I'm told, and this happens quite a bit, "We don't think about race when we hire. We just hire the best person for the job."